NT Wright Explains Why the Apostle Paul Is So Misunderstood, Yet So Extraordinary (Interview)

 

New Testament scholar and retired Anglican bishop N.T. "Tom" Wright, 69, has a new book, Paul: A Biography, which aims to help readers wrestling with the words of the Apostle by highlighting his distinctly Jewish roots.

When Christians engage in the life and writing of the Apostle Paul, their assumptions and conclusions are all too often misplaced.

But that is because the man best known for his lofty epistles to churches in Rome, Greece, and Asia Minor has been divorced from his Jewish heritage and way of thinking over the centuries of Gentile Christianity. 

Paul never abandoned his Jewishness even as his ministry mostly occurred among Gentile believers, Wright argues; choosing to ignore or erase the Jewish significance to Paul's words is to disregard something profoundly important, rendering portions of the Scripture only partially understandable.

Wright's previous scholarship on Paul's theology and writing include Paul and the Faithfulness of God (2013), Paul: In Fresh Perspective (2009), and The Climax of the Covenant: Christ and the Law in Pauline Theology (1991/1992).

But biographers ask different sorts of questions, Wright notes in the preface, inquiries that search for "the man behind the texts." Substantive yet accessible, Paul provides a 432-page exploration of the Apostle's beginnings, his missionary journeys, his struggles and passion, and much more.

Below is a lightly edited transcript of The Christian Post's interview with the esteemed theologian and Pauline scholar.

CP: In all your years of biblical scholarship, ministry, and in the research and writing of this biography, what have you found to be the most common misconception among Christians and non-Christians about this man, Paul, whom the Holy Spirit inspired to deliver so much counsel to His Church?

TW: The most common misconception is that Paul was arrogant, muddled, misogynistic, and so on. Whenever people find something he says either difficult to understand (see below!) or too demanding on belief or behavior, the usual response is 'Oh, he just had a bad day when he wrote that bit' ... whereas in my long experience a little more thought and work on the passage usually reveals unsuspected depths and powerful meaning.

CP: The Apostle Peter famously wrote that Paul's letters contain things that are hard to understand and are distorted by ignorant and unstable people (2 Peter 3:16). Yet many sincere Christians also have a difficult time comprehending the words of Paul and would identify with Peter, as Paul's writings are often the subject of intense, vigorous debate about what exactly he is saying. Why has he been and still is so misunderstood?

TW: Paul's writings are dense. He was writing often in difficult circumstances (in prison, on journeys, etc.) and often didn't have a chance to correct let alone expand what he was saying. In particular, he was trying to tease his readers/hearers into thinking for themselves, not simply accepting pre-packaged formulae without reflection.

But this means that, like many poets and other artists, he has to risk leaving questions open (though he's pretty clear on a lot of things!). In particular, because he knows his Bible inside out he can assume that his hearers can follow him when he's stringing together ideas that for their full meaning demand a ready grasp of the larger contexts of the passages in question. And he was writing within the complexities of the larger Greco-Roman world in which the swirling philosophies of the time meant that the same sentence could easily be interpreted in different ways, particularly by people who didn't know Paul personally ...

CP: It could be argued that Paul's life constitutes one of the greatest if not the greatest redemptive stories in all of Scripture. A man who once murderously opposed the followers of the Way encounters Jesus, is blinded en route to Damascus, and is in the years that followed used by God powerfully and pens approximately 1/3 of the New Testament. What did it mean for him to exchange such zeal to do evil for zeal for the Gospel and the surpassing greatness of knowing Christ (Philippians 3:8)?

TW: It was of course a total turn-around from one point of view; but, from another, Paul firmly believed he was still following the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob as he had throughout his life. There are parallels: Moses had killed the Egyptian and had to run away, but God called him to a new task; Elijah killed the prophets of Baal and then had to run away and God recommissioned him . . . But in Paul's case what it all meant was, of course, that Jesus of Nazareth really was Israel's Messiah, designated as such through his resurrection, and that he really had inaugurated the new world for which he (and all Israel) had longed – even though it didn't look like Paul had imagined previously.

If this sounds confusing to us, it was no doubt deeply shocking for Paul himself, which is why it took time – not least his trip to Mount Sinai in Arabia, like Elijah! – to get his head and his heart around it all. And then the ten 'silent' years back home in Tarsus after his early efforts to persuade people of the truth of the gospel ... that must have been a hugely demanding time, but all we later know of Paul indicates that he used it to go deeper and deeper in prayer and scriptural understanding which would then bear such fruit in his remarkable traveling work.

CP: In your book, you maintain that scholars and pastors have not sufficiently considered the "human side" of Paul. How and why have they failed to do this?

TW: When you treat Paul's letters as 'holy scripture' (as I personally have always done) it is very tempting to think of them as simply 'words from above,' not also 'the words of a human being, often drawn out of him through suffering...' But it's only when we examine the real human situations in which Paul found himself, particularly his imprisonments and often terrible circumstances, that we really understand what he was talking about.

He saw himself as a walking illustration or example of the truth of the gospel of the crucified Messiah. To understand that, we need to look long and hard at his human side. That is where we then discern the true word of God in his human words.

CP: You stress that although the main focus of Paul's ministry was to the Gentiles, Paul cannot be separated from his Jewishness, that his life and work can only be understood in the context of the Jewish world in which he once lived. Why is grasping that vital to understanding his subsequent endeavors in Rome and elsewhere?

TW: Paul never stopped thinking, speaking, and writing as a Jew – a Jew who believed that the One God had sent the true Messiah. Generations of Gentile Christianity have often tried to ignore or even erase that Jewish meaning, turning 'Christianity' into an essentially non-Jewish system and making most of Paul's major themes only semi-comprehensible.

Paul's message for the Gentile world was precise that Israel's God had defeated the idols worshiped by the pagans and had launched a new way of being human in which the scriptures had all come true in a new way. Non-Jewish groups from the second century onwards have always tried to flatten this message out into a 'new way of being religious' or of 'being saved' – a way which could then be played off against the world of ancient Israel and its scriptures. But every step in that direction is a step away from Paul.

CP: You also trace the Apostle through his missionary journeys, noting his perseverance through being shipwrecked, jailed, and nearly killed several times. Why is what he accomplished so extraordinary in light of the fervent opposition he endured?

TW: Paul's accomplishments rank him as among the greatest public intellectuals of all time – up there with Plato or Cicero. Yet they lived privileged lives – albeit in a dangerous world – and Paul was always on the move, only able to write short, tight-packed letters, not leisurely treatises and dialogues. His utter self-giving to his communities, and his modeling of the new way of life he was commending, was more powerful still, as people realized that there was indeed a new way of being human launched upon the world and this is what it looked like.

That's why when Paul told them that he was imitating the Messiah so they should imitate him they started to do just that ... and the rest is (church) history.

CP: It's rather remarkable that your book has come out around the same time as the movie Paul: Apostle of Christ. Have you seen it, and if so, what did you think?

TW: I haven't seen the movie  ... but yes, it's interesting as a coincidence. I suspect it will find it hard to condense what needs to be said into the normal time-frame for a movie. I would rather make a series of television programs ... but that's another story.

CP: It sure seems that many Christians in the West are now struggling to find a language with which to engage culture, not only because of the proliferation of digital technology but, as you mentioned in a London Times editorial last August, a resurgent Gnosticism overhauling once thought obvious definitions of things like 'male' and 'female,' which yields confusion about "the ultimate reality of the natural world." Yet these present challenges, while profound, are really not so new. As you document extensively in your biography of Paul, the Apostle faced all kinds of issues relating to the Gentile and pagan people groups among whom he ministered during his travels. He had to change his language radically (perhaps most famously when he addressed the Athenians in Acts 17) in order to communicate the Gospel message effectively. How might Christians take a page from Paul and learn to speak to an increasingly hostile, secular society that does not understand them?

TW: The Acts speech was a legal defense against the charge of 'introducing foreign divinities' – part of the accusation that had condemned Socrates. The 'Areopagus' was not a debating society; it was the highest court in the land. Paul's speech to the court was not a 'change of language'; it was addressing a different set of questions. His message was always about the one true God and his purposes, over against the pagan gods (see 1 Thessalonians 1, probably written at the same time when he was in Athens), and this is what comes across in the speech.

However, the point is important: Paul declares in 2 Corinthians 10 that he 'takes every thought captive to obey the Messiah', and it is vital that Christians in every generation learn to do the same, in particular (as Paul insists) to discern what matters, to distinguish things that differ, to be wise as serpents and innocent as doves.

The message of the crucified and risen Messiah is of course not 'comprehensible' in terms of anyone's worldview – but as Paul discovered it possesses a strange power to go to the heart of things and to transform human beings and societies with the presence and power of the living God.

CP: How has writing a biography on Paul deepened your own faith?

TW: It has helped me to see myself as living within the long and often complex and troubling story of how the Jesus-movement makes its way in the world.

It has reminded me that being faithful to Jesus doesn't mean being 'successful' in the world's eyes, nor being free from pain and trouble; but that it will produce, again and again, a joy that transcends all of that.

Most Christians misunderstand what Heaven really is, says NT Wright

 Brandon Showalter 

Prominent theologian NT Wright says the New Testament does not say what most people believe it says about Heaven, which is that it's merely a place one goes after death. In truth, he says, it's about creation being restored through God's ever-advancing Kingdom.

In an editorial for TIME magazine, the former Anglican bishop and acclaimed author stressed that, contrary to contemporary believers, early Christians did not conceive of Heaven as merely a place they go when they die.

Those who did believe in the idea of "going to Heaven when you die" when the New Testament was written were "Middle Platonists" those like Plutarch, a pagan priest in Delphi.

"To understand what the first followers of Jesus believed about what happens after death, we need to read the New Testament in its own world — the world of Jewish hope, of Roman imperialism, and of Greek thought," he said.

"The followers of the Jesus movement that grew up in that complex environment saw 'Heaven' and 'Earth' — God's space and ours if you like — as the twin halves of God's good creation."

Instead of saving people from Earth, early Christians believed God was bringing Heaven and Earth together, making creation new, and restoring the world from all its pathologies.

"They believed that God would then raise His people from the dead, to share in — and, indeed, to share His stewardship over — this rescued and renewed creation. And they believed all this because of Jesus," Wright stressed.

Christ's resurrection was the starting point of this great work of renewal, He went on to say, and this was understood by the earliest believers.

"Jesus embodied in Himself the perfect fusion of 'Heaven' and 'Earth.' In Jesus, therefore, the ancient Jewish hope had come true at last. The point was not for us to 'go to Heaven,' but for the life of Heaven to arrive on Earth," Wright said, noting that Jesus taught His followers to pray for God's Kingdom to come on Earth as it is in Heaven.

"From as early as the third century, some Christian teachers tried to blend this with types of the Platonic belief, generating the idea of 'leaving Earth and going to Heaven,' which became mainstream by the Middle Ages. But Jesus' first followers never went that route."

To understand the Gospel in its fullness, Wright told The Christian Post in a previous interview that believers in Jesus must rediscover their distinctly Jewish spiritual heritage that is a given in the New Testament but has, for a variety of reasons, been lost over the centuries.

In his biography about the Apostle Paul, Wright said Paul "never stopped thinking, speaking and writing as a Jew — a Jew who believed that the One God had sent the true Messiah."

"Generations of Gentile Christianity have often tried to ignore or even erase that Jewish meaning, turning 'Christianity' into an essentially non-Jewish system and making most of Paul's major themes only semi-comprehensible," he told CP at the time.

Non-Jewish groups since the second century have attempted to flatten the message of salvation — into a "new way of being religious" or of "being saved" — from ancient Israel's understanding of it, he explained.

"Israel's scriptures had long promised that God would come back in person to dwell with His people forever. The early Christians picked this up: 'The Word became flesh,' declares John [1:14], 'and dwelt in our midst.' The word for 'dwelt' means, literally, 'tabernacled,' 'pitched his tent' — alluding to the wilderness 'tabernacle' in the time of Moses and the Temple built by Solomon," Wright wrote Monday in TIME.

"Studying the New Testament historically, in its own world (as opposed to squashing and chopping it to fit with our own expectations), shows that the first Christians believed not that they would 'go to Heaven when they died,' but that, in Jesus, God had come to live with them."

He added, "It's hard for us moderns to grasp this: so many hymns, prayers, and sermons still speak of us 'going to Heaven.'"

According to the Pew Research Center's 2014 Religious Landscape Study, 72 percent of Americans said they believe in Heaven. In the survey, Heaven was defined as a place "where people who have led good lives are eternally rewarded."

In that same study, 37 percent of those who do not affiliate with any particular religious tradition, known as "nones," said they believed in Heaven.

Courtesy of The Christian Post

Piper Addresses Strange Fire and Charismatic Chaos by John Piper

One month ago, John MacArthur hosted a conference titled “Strange Fire.” The conference opposed the so-called “prosperity gospel” and with it the excesses of “charismania.” But somewhere along the way all things charismatic and continuationist got swept up into the conference conversation, too, igniting a strange online conflagration of its own.

The conversation prompted a variety of questions from listeners of the Ask Pastor John podcast. Before boarding a flight for the Middle East, John Piper agreed to field a few of the questions, particularly:

If you’re a continuationist (believing the supernatural gifts of the Spirit continue still today), why doesn’t this show up more often in your ministry?

Why do you not seem persuaded enough to advocate that others pursue the gifts of tongues and prophecy today?
How do you define contemporary prophecy?
Are there charismatic abuses that need to be addressed?
Open, Cautious, or Advocate?

At the conference, Piper was characterized as open to the gifts but not advocating for them or encouraging others to pursue the gifts themselves. This is a misunderstanding, says Piper. “I advocate obedience to 1 Corinthians 12:31, ‘earnestly desire the higher gifts.’ And I advocate obedience to 1 Corinthians 14:1, ‘earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you might prophesy.’ And I advocate obedience to 1 Corinthians 14:39, ‘earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.’ I want Christians today to obey those texts.”

And Piper seeks to obey those texts himself. “I pray for the gift of prophecy almost as often as I pray for anything, before I stand up to speak.” This prayer for prophecy is a desire to preach under an anointing, in order to “say things agreeable to the Scriptures, and subject to the Scripture, that are not in my manuscript or in my head as I walk into the pulpit, nor thought of ahead of time, which would come to my mind, which would pierce in an extraordinary way, so that 1 Corinthians 14:24–25 happens.”

But has Piper advocated for gifts like prophecy enough over his decades of pastoring and writing? “My effort to prioritize may be imperfect, but my answer is that I try to live up to what I see in the text and advocate for it as I see it in relation to all the other things that I preach on.”

A sampling from his ministry shows Piper’s consistency both in his definition of prophecy and in his encouragement that others pursue the gift (see resources from 1981, 1990, 1991, 2004, and 2013).

What Is Prophecy Today?

Piper’s view on prophecy raises another question. If MacArthur believes the gift of prophecy has ceased, what exegetical proofs would Piper argue to the contrary?

Four crucial texts came to Piper’s mind. First, 1 Corinthians 14:29 seems to indicate New Testament prophecy endures in the church age, but not as a prophecy that’s on the same level of authority as Scripture. It’s fundamentally a different type of prophecy.

Second, 1 Thessalonians 5:20–21 makes the same point. This passage indicates that the discernment of prophesy in the local church takes on a different shape. “You are not choosing between people here [false prophet/true prophet], it seems to me, like in 1 John 4:1. Rather, you are choosing between what they say [true prophecy/false prophecy], which you would not do if they spoke with infallible, inerrant Scripture-quality authority.”

“The issue here is that some in the church are despising not the prophets, but the prophecies. Now why would that be? Probably because they are sometimes whacko. Despise is a very strong word. Paul says, ‘don’t despise.’ So somebody in the church at Thessalonica is saying, ‘Look. You told us that prophecy is a gift from God. Frankly, we do not like what we are hearing, because it is stupid. It is weird. They are saying things that are off the wall.’ And so they tend to despise them. And Paul seems to be trying to keep the people from throwing the baby of true prophecies out with the bathwater of weird ones.”

Third, 1 Corinthians 11:4–5 encourages prophecies from women in the church. Said Piper, “I don’t see how women prophesying in the assembly fits with an infallible Scripture-level authority when Paul forbids that kind of authority to be exercised over men by women in the church in 1 Timothy 2:12. So the fact that women are encouraged to do this, and yet women are told not to exercise authority over men, says to me that we have got something going on here besides what is Scripture-level authority.”

The fourth text, 1 Corinthians 13:8–10, is “a pretty clear argument, I think, that the gift of prophecy and tongues will continue until Jesus comes back. And it seems to me that the reason they pass away, it says, is precisely because they are imperfect; they are not Scripture-level authority. Verse nine says we prophesy ek meros (Greek for ‘in part’), just like a little child trying to reason and think and talk. And when he grows up and becomes a man in the age to come, he won’t need that kind of help anymore.”

These few texts don’t settle all the issues, but they do combine to establish a legitimate exegetical basis for an ongoing gift of prophecy, distinguished from Scripture-level authoritative prophecy, a unique channel of prophecy to be discerned and then embraced in the healthy local church.

Charismatic Abuses?

Looking more broadly at the Church today, Piper was eager to address charismatic abuses and excesses (charismania). “But,” he began, “we really need to keep in mind that every charismatic abuse has its mirror image in non-charismatic abuses. Nothing I am going to say is unique to charismatics. In some of these cases, the non-charismatic church is more guilty than the charismatic.”

He addressed four abuses in particular: doctrine, emotion, discernment, and finance.

Doctrine Abuses

“There are many doctrinal abuses in the charismatic church where experience is elevated above doctrine, and doctrine is made minimally important. I think that is a huge defect in many charismatic churches. The fear is this: if you try to study the Bible with a view to assembling a coherent view of doctrine, you are going to quench the Spirit, and you won’t have as much vitality in your heart, because the mind and the heart are at odds with each other. That is a mistake, I think, and it is an abuse of experience to make it the enemy of — or the alternative to — doctrine.”

He shared a firsthand example. “I have been in prophetic meetings with charismatic groups where the Bible was treated like the priming of the pump for phenomena. So what you really want in this room is some fireworks: you want somebody to fall down, or somebody to laugh, or somebody to tremble, or somebody to raise their hands, or somebody to hear a word of extraordinary prophecy like, the man in the red shirt is going to Argentina next week, and nobody could know that, but the prophet. You want all that stuff to happen. And so what do you do with the Bible? You use it like pouring water into a pump. And everybody knows you don’t care about the text, you don’t care about this sermon; you are using the sermon to get us ready for the fireworks at the end. Wherever I saw that happening, I knew we were in trouble. I knew that no matter what kind of fireworks were coming they were going to be skewed and misused because the speaker, the one in charge, was not God-centered, Christ-exalting, Bible-saturated.”

Emotion Abuses

Second, Piper addressed emotional abuses.

True prophecy is displayed not in emotional madness, but in orderliness (1 Corinthians 14:29). “If you are a true prophet, if you have got the Holy Spirit, if you are real, . . . you can sit down and wait your turn. The fruit of the Holy Spirit is patience, and kindness, and meekness, and thankfulness, and self-control. So sit down Mr. Prophet and wait your turn.

“And I think there are a lot of people who don’t think that way. They don’t think that biblically informed principles of good behavior can trump the ecstasies of a person who is, say, speaking in tongues or prophesying,” he said. “Application of the Word governs life in the church, not the emotional sway of some strong person in the moment.”

Both these doctrinal and emotional abuses can be flipped around.

“Think of all the doctrinal errors in the history of the Church. Those weren’t charismatics, by and large. Think of all the dying mainline churches today with all their moral and doctrinal aberrations. These aren’t charismatics. And think of the emotional deadness in thousands of non-charismatic evangelical and mainline churches. Those are deadly emotional abuses. And we just need to remember that if we target the charismatic church because of things that are happening there doctrinally and emotionally, let’s remember the mirror images which are equally deadly, that are happening among non-charismatic churches as well.”

To reiterate this second point, Piper said, “There are emotional abuses in the non-charismatic church, namely the absence of emotion, which is probably more deadly than the excesses.”

Discernment Abuses

Another abuse is a failure to differentiate genuine prophecies from hollow ones. This helps explain why Paul says, “Do not despise prophecies, but test everything, hold fast to what is good” (1 Thessalonians 5:20–21).

“That is very strong language,” commented Piper. “And I think it is because some of those folks were claiming to speak for God, and it resulted in foolishness. They weren’t speaking for God. And it resulted in an emotional pushback in the church. The church said, ‘We don’t want that.’ And Paul was trying to rescue prophecy from a broad brush sweeping it away entirely by saying, ‘Whoa, wait a minute. Discern what is good here and discern what is bad here. Don’t throw it all away. Make distinctions in the various claims to hold it fast.’”

Again, Piper shared from experience. “I have been prophesied over numerous times, and two of them were just whacko. It was so hard in those [early ministry] days to take prophecy seriously. I resonated with the folks who were starting to ‘despise prophecies.’

“A lawyer one time prophesied over me when my wife was pregnant and said: ‘Your fourth child is going to be a girl, and your wife is going to die in childbirth.’ And that lawyer with tears told me that she was sorry she had to tell me that. So I went home and I got down on my knees and I said, ‘Lord, I am trying to do what you said here in 1 Thessalonians 5:20–21. And frankly, I despise what that woman just said.’ It proved out that my fourth child was a son, and I knew as soon as he came out that that prophecy was not true, and so I stopped having any misgivings about my wife’s life. She is still with me now thirty years later. That’s the sort of thing that makes you despise prophecy.”

This failure to discern prophecies within charismatic churches tempts others to simply dismiss all prophecies outright.

Finance Abuses

Finally, there are financial abuses. The key text here is 1 Timothy 6:5. Some false teachers within the charismatic movement “imagine that godliness is a means of gain.”

“So it is possible to have a teaching gift or a healing gift, some kind of a remarkable gift that is so popular you make millions of dollars. And you start feeling entitled to all the lavish clothes, lavish cars, lavish houses, lavish jets, and lavish hotel accommodations, turning godliness into a means of gain, and justifying it by the fact that you are so gifted and so many people are benefiting from what you say. To whom Paul would say: ‘But those who desire to be rich fall into temptation, into a snare, into many senseless and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and destruction’ (1 Timothy 6:9).

“My alternative is to preach ‘Christian Hedonism’ that says: pursue contentment in God, not in things. ‘But godliness with contentment is great gain, for we brought nothing into the world, and we cannot take anything out of the world. But if we have food and clothing, with these we will be content’ (1 Timothy 6:6–8).”

But this abuse, too, can be flipped. “We tend to think of charismatics when we think of people abusing finances in this way. All you have to do is listen to the Twittersphere to know that is not the case. There are just as many non-charismatic leaders who are using their status as an effective spiritual leader to make a lot of money, and accumulate a lot of money, and look like they have a lot of money. And I want to say that there are a lot of simple, honest, humble charismatic pastors living on modest salaries who are less guilty than many non-charismatics when it comes to financial abuses.”

Not on a Warpath

On each point, it is surely misguided to single out charismatics, says Piper. “Charismatic doctrinal abuses, emotional abuses, discernment abuses, financial abuses, all have their mirror image in non-charismatic churches.” Of charismatics and non-charismatics alike, “we all stand under the word of God and we all need repentance.”

But those charismatic abuses remain. So how are these excesses best policed? How are Christians today protected from the abuses of the charismatic church? Is it through attack-centered books and conferences?

“I don’t go on a warpath against charismatics. I go on a crusade to spread truth. I am spreading gospel-centered, Christ-exalting, Bible-saturated, Calvinistic truth everywhere, and I am going to push it into the face of every charismatic I can find, because what I believe, if they embrace the biblical system of doctrine that is really there, it will bring all of their experiences into the right orbit around the sun of this truth.”

John Piper Talks John MacArthur's Strange Fire Conference; Pursuing Gifts of Prophecy and Speaking in Tongues

BY NICOLA MENZIE , CHRISTIAN POST REPORTER

John MacArthur during his anti-Charismatic Strange Fire conference last month said that he believes fellow Christian theologian John Piper's "openness to modern charismatic gifts is an anomaly" and may inadvertently lend support to an aspect of Christianity he finds unbiblical.

MacArthur, expanding on those comments with evangelical Christian blogger Tim Challies earlier this month, mentioned D.A. Carson, Wayne Grudem and Piper as men who he loves as "as co-workers in the ministry of the gospel" but expressed concern that their openness to the charismatic gives the movement weight.

"My major concern is that their openness to the issue unwittingly gives the whole movement an aura of theological credibility that it does not deserve," said MacArthur, pastor of Grace Community Church in Sun Valley, Calif.

MacArthur is a cessationist who believes charismatic gifts like prophecy and speaking in tongues and interpretation of tongues ended with Jesus Christ's first century apostles.

In October, the California minister used his Strange Fire conference to speak out against what he considers unbiblical aspects of the charismatic movement, insisting that members of the movement have been attributing to the Holy Spirit things that are ungodly.

While MacArthur and Piper both subscribe to some form of Reformed, or Calvinist theology, the later, like Carson and Grudem, is a continuationist. Piper supports the belief that the Holy Spirit continues today to empower Christians with spiritual gifts.

Piper, through his Desiring God ministry website, has addressed MacArthur's Strange Fire conference, as well as questions from many of his ministry supporters regarding charismatic gifts.

Tony Reinke, a blogger for Piper's DesiringGod.org, explains:

At the conference, Piper was characterized as open to the gifts but not advocating for them or encouraging others to pursue the gifts themselves. This is a misunderstanding, says Piper. "I advocate obedience to 1 Corinthians 12:31, 'earnestly desire the higher gifts.' And I advocate obedience to 1 Corinthians 14:1, 'earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you might prophesy.' And I advocate obedience to 1 Corinthians 14:39, 'earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.' I want Christians today to obey those texts."

As explained in the post, Piper not only advocates obedience to those New Testament passages, but he himself pursues such spiritual gifts, specifically prophecy, which means for him preaching "under an anointing" from God:

This prayer for prophecy is a desire to preach under an anointing, in order to "say things agreeable to the Scriptures, and subject to the Scripture, that are not in my manuscript or in my head as I walk into the pulpit, nor thought of ahead of time, which would come to my mind, which would pierce in an extraordinary way, so that 1 Corinthians 14:24–25 happens."

The DesiringGod.org post points readers to two video interviews with Piper posted in January of this year in which the theologian answers two questions: What is Speaking Tongues? and What is the Gift of Prophecy in the New Covenant?

Piper explains in the videos that he does not believe that he has ever "authentically spoken in tongues," but has prayed for God to give him the ability, he says in obedience to 1 Corinthians 12:31.

While Piper disagrees with MacArthur on the issue of spiritual gifts still being given by the Holy Spirit to Christians today, the two men do agree that there are "abuses and excesses" in the charismatic movement — particularly in cases where experience is given priority and the importance of doctrine is minimized.

"I think that is a huge defect in many charismatic churches," explained Piper. "The fear is this: if you try to study the Bible with a view to assembling a coherent view of doctrine, you are going to quench the Spirit, and you won't have as much vitality in your heart, because the mind and the heart are at odds with each other. That is a mistake, I think, and it is an abuse of experience to make it the enemy of — or the alternative to — doctrine."

The former Bethlehem Baptist Church pastor did not neglect to note his concerns regarding discernment and finance abuses present in the charismatic movement, but noted again that these abuses are not present only in Christian charismatic communities.

"Charismatic doctrinal abuses, emotional abuses, discernment abuses, financial abuses, all have their mirror image in non-charismatic churches," says Piper.

Piper also cautioned that there was a danger tied to the absence of emotion in some non-charismatic churches, which he suggested "is probably more deadly than the excesses."

He shared that his approach in correcting these abuses was not to "go on a warpath against charismatics," but instead to "spread truth."

"I am spreading gospel-centered, Christ-exalting, Bible-saturated, Calvinistic truth everywhere, and I am going to push it into the face of every charismatic I can find, because what I believe, if they embrace the biblical system of doctrine that is really there, it will bring all of their experiences into the right orbit around the sun of this truth," he said.

Visit DesiringGod.org to read and hear Piper's responses in full regarding John MacArthur's Strange Fire conference, their differing theologies on spiritual gifts, and his take on "charismatic abuses": http://www.desiringgod.org/blog/posts/piper-addresses-strange-fire-and-charismatic-chaos.

Read more about the Strange Fire conference:
MacArthur Responds to Critics Who Believe His Strange Fire Conference Is Divisive, Unloving;
'Strange Fire' Conference: John MacArthur Calls Out Charismatic Movement as 'Unfaithful'